To imply that transmen are in anyway less than men is transophobic. You are assuming that transmen aren’t men by saying that they don’t have male privilege. They are men and have male privelge. That’s it.
And lol yeah cus truscum piles of shit are “my fellow queers” yeah I hate men fuck you.
nah man, as a cis person I still have more privilege than someone who is trans. Take a fucking look around, get off the computer for like, two seconds. I see that shit at my job all the time. I’ve never been called “it”, misnamed, or misgendered. I have never had threats against my life because of my gender identity when I’m out in the city. Transmen have to deal with that shit all the time.
And not once did I imply that trans means less than. You just made that shit up. Less hate, more logic plz. You’re just being reactionary at this point.
It’s dangerous to go alone, take this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qwlC0QWxj88
I think you’ve made a good point. Two things bother me here, that are closely related to one another:
1) The technically valid but unsound argument of x is a man/male; all men/males have male privilege; therefore x has privilege.
Thinking about privilege this way seems to contribute to a lot of misunderstandings. These arguments treat the privilege of men as if it somehow exists separate from human relationships, as an intrinsic feature resulting from their definition instead of being dependent upon social forces, oppressive institutions, education, history, etc. etc.
A young boy is swept onto a desert island, where he grows to be a man. He is assumed dead. No one searches for him. He is the only human on the island, where he ages and dies alone. Through his adulthood, does he have male privilege?
This is a thought experiment; I am giving strict parameters for a reason. But in case a person still decides to misread the example and insist that he does - because of how his loss and death is covered, I guess - what if he had washed ashore as a young trans boy, who was assumed by everyone else to be a girl?
If we answer that Island Man has male privilege, then privilege ceases to be a useful notion. It has no correlates. It’s an empty property.
But privilege isn’t meaningless, for the same reason Island Man lacks it during his stay! It just so happens that privilege is a property that only makes sense in terms of relationships among actual people and relevant social institutions. Maleness is weirdly enough insufficient for male privilege, though it is obviously and overwhelmingly correlated with it.
If one wants to insist otherwise, they need to justify why. And it seems that the only way to argue men are Privileged by Definition would be to somehow argue that men are Objectively Superior - and that this superiority means they are by definition privileged, regardless of context.
I hope we all can agree that this is not the case.
2) I don’t, of course, want to argue that trans men don’t tend to have male privilege. What does bother me is that acknowledging trans and cis men often occupy different circumstances and are often perceived differently - so therefore tend to have different levels of privilege - is somehow equivalent to saying trans men are less than men. That it somehow makes you a transphobe. The gambit there is really pathetic.
And if it’s not a pathetic gambit, it’s a failure to understand intersectionality. Which is understandable. It’s confusing. There are fuck tons of social forces at work, and all of those systems of oppression can interact with each other to create an awful shit stew. But the bare assumption that a trans person would be overall privileged over a cis person simply because that trans person is male is really confusing.
I could see cases where, looking at individuals, the trans man might be more privileged - for example, a wealthy trans man with a good infrastructure who lives stealth might easily be more privileged than a cis woman of the same race and SES. But trans people have a harder time getting jobs and are treated to dehumanizing bullshit all the time, and in our current climate I think we’ll usually find the trans guy worse for wear. In cases where the amount of male privilege is middling - imagine a pre-T trans guy who never passes, in a conservative area - the idea that any cis woman is somehow justified attacking or abandoning trans men because they are “oppressors” is just…well, it makes me disappointed in what passes for social justice.
Because it’s choosing to ignore what privilege is, and how it operates. It’s choosing to ignore that being privileged in one area doesn’t protect one against overwhelming oppression in another. And it’s choosing to ignore the way transgender lives have been erased over time by cisgender people, including women.
And that’s bullshit.
thank you canis. I feel ya. Intersectionality is damn important, it’s not always just man vs. woman. In fact, it doesn’t even have to be ____ vs ____. Screaming scum every five seconds sure as hell doesn’t solve anything.
theoryof, keep on with the bigotry. I don’t think anyone will take you seriously, but if you refuse to see what a turd yr being, that’s not on me. Maybe you will understand when you are older.